| future years. The whole system upon public and private money. The majority which they were going was experimental, of the House was, he believed, agreed as to and every one who had the cause of edu- the principle that grants of public money cation at heart must concur in wishing to should be given only in aid of voluntary be let alone for a year or two to see how undertakings for the education of the poor the system worked. With regard to cer--the main intention of such aid being tificates, any one who took the trouble to to improve that which had previously exread the Parliamentary papers, and espe- isted. It must also be admitted that no cially two letters of a most excellent system of public grants could be safely adschool inspector, Mr. Norris-a man who ministered without rigid rules and checks. was known to be a gentleman of great Whatever difference of opinion there might ability, of great experience, and of the be as to the Revised Code, it had at least greatest sincerity-would find that the evi- this good point about it, that it threw back dence in their favour was very strong in- on the voluntary managers the charge of deed. Another reason for saying the mo- the schools for the poor, and restricted the ment was inopportune was that they did grants from the Treasury to the aid of such not know what expense would be entailed undertakings. It sought for guarantees of by the additional labours of the inspectors the work of education being really carried which the Resolution would involve, or how out by those whom the Treasury aided. many additional inspectors would have to The tests established by the Code were be appointed, or how much time the in- three in number:-First, that the scholars spection of so many more schools would individually should furnish some proof that require, or whether they could be inspected they had received elementary instruction; at all under the new Code. Under these secondly, that the inspection of the school circumstances, and with a strong feeling should show satisfactory results as to atthat it was most desirable that when a tendance and the general condition of the great measure had once been passed, with establishment; and thirdly, that the school whatever feelings it was regarded, it ought should employ a certificated teacher. It was to be fully and carefully put to the proof very reasonably stipulated that no school before it was meddled with by legislation, should be entitled to public money which he should not vote with the hon. Member did not fulfil these three conditions; that for Berkshire. is, if not even elementary instruction were given, if the scholars did not attend, and the master could not pass an examination for certificate. The hon. Member for Berkshire, however, coolly proposed, that within twelve months of the adoption of that system, two out of the three checks should be abolished, and that the Treasury should be open to all schools which could show scholars at the lowest standard of elementary instruction. Since the hon. Gentleman first gave notice of his Motion he had somewhat modified it, and now asked only part of the grant for schools which only complied with the first test. That, however, did not in the least affect the principle of his Resolutions, which was the same whether it was applied to a part or the whole of the grant. The hon. Gentleman had thrown his proposition into a terse, well-rounded, plausible syllogism. The public money, he said, was promised by the Revised Code on certain results being shown; these results could be secured, not only by the specified means, but in a thousand other ways, and therefore the public money was due to those results, however obtained. The fallacy of the syllogism lay in its first premiss, in which MR. ADDERLEY said, that before the debate closed he was anxious to call the attention of the House to the Amendment to the first Resolution, which he proposed to move. The proposal of the hon. Member for Berkshire went as far as to create a new distinction in regard to poorer schools, and to abolish the use of certificates to teachers. He owned that the hon. Member for Berkshire ought to have full credit for the indefatigable industry with which he had mastered the subject, and for the perfect fairness and obviously high intentions with which he had brought forward his Resolutions. He could not agree with the Seconder, the hon. Member for Maidstone, that the effect of the Resolutions, if carried out, would be anything short of the destruction of a principal feature of the present system. He was rather surprised to find that a gentle man who had given such substantial proofs of his interest in national education should be ready in so summary a way to endanger, if not absolutely to demolish, the chief element of the system which they had occupied thirty years in setting up, and on which they had spent millions both of grant, and for that purpose he proposed that the test should be restricted to mere attendance, and that certificated masters should no longer be indispensable, in fact, that the lowest hedge school, if it could reach the art of spelling and the first rules of arithmetic, should pass muster for Treasury payment. But he would ask the had given to lead to the belief that any decent schools of the country districts were excluded from the receipt of the grant. He had looked through the blue-book of correspondence of the hon. Gentleman, but he had failed to find any such conclusion established. There was not a case of a single schoolmaster of any schools worthy of receiving a farthing from the public Treasury who might not obtain a certifi cate if he chose. He therefore entirely denied the proposition that the schools of the poor could not come within the reach of the grant, the fact being that they would not in every case in which they did not. the hon. Gentleman designated as total results those proofs of merely elementary instruction which formed one of the three prescribed tests. That test was of the most meagre kind, and even the opponents of the Code had attempted to get it improved. It did not cover even the field of elementary instruction, for it omitted a most material part of it-religious teach-House what grounds the hon. Gentleman ing. [Mr. WALTER: No, no; that is a result required by Her Majesty's Inspectors of Schools.] The hon. Member, he believed, was mistaken on that point, and therefore his proposal was defective in not providing for religious instruction. Moreover, the syllogism ignored the two other tests enforced by the Code-the tests of Government inspection and certificated masters. The intention of the hon.-Member's Resolutions was obvious, and on the first blush was a good one. It was to bring the " poorer schools" of the country within the scope of the Government grants. Now, he was satisfied that there was nothing more mischievous in a system of public grants than to permit an exception from The real obstacle was not the stipulathe general rule. [Mr. HENLEY: Hear, tion for a certificated master, but rather a hear!] The right hon. Gentleman con- certain timidity, or perhaps pride, on befirmed that opinion, and could not therefore half of the old teachers which prevented support the Resolutions, which in express them from submitting themselves to examiterms required special indulgence to poorer nation. Another obstacle was the narrowschools. The fact was, that the excep-mindedness of some of the managers of the tions were sure to become rules. That distant rural schools-small farmers and could be aptly illustrated in the very De- tradesmen-who objected to exposing thempartment under consideration. The old selves to Government inspection. He could capitation grants were originated for the mention several instances in his own neighassistance of poor schools, and an attempt bourhood in which contributions towards was made in the Minute to define what the establishment or improvement of a were poor schools. The definition, of school had upon those grounds been recourse, broke down entirely, and the excep- fused, because the donors had stipulated tional assistance to poor schools became a for having Government inspection. A third regular largess to rich schools. If it were and a fourth obstacle were to be found in thought that the present system were the objection sometimes raised by the clergy forced beyond its original intention, and to associating small adjoining parishes tohad so deserted the poorer classes for gether for the purpose of forming a school; whom it was primarily intended, there and in the occasional illiberality of genwas still no necessity for disturbing the tlemen in the rural districts, who refused machinery by which it was worked. The to put their hands in their pockets, hoping proper course, on the contrary, to take that the Government would support a would be to bring the whole system down to school for them, and not much caring its intended level. While, however, he whether it did or not. Such were the should urge the restriction of public grants obstacles which kept some rural schools to schools for the poor, the House ought to from the grant, and it was not his intendistinguish that from giving public grants tion to upset the existing system, which to poor schools. The business of Parlia- worked well when not so impeded, simply ment was not to favour schools of an in- in order to get rid of such impediments. ferior kind, but to give a lift to the schools The hon. Gentleman's correspondents who of the inferior classes. The great object disagreed with him had truly said that a of the hon. Member for Berkshire was to certificate was not only a scholastic guaranget poor schools within the reach of the tee but an economy to a school. Were they to yield to the prejudices of those who could | a paralysing blow at the training colleges not see that fact, clearly as it might be in this country, they would never revive. substantiated if there were only a will with Many persons had spent their £100 and the way to that conclusion. The hon. £1,000 in establishing and maintaining Gentleman asked what was the use of the training colleges; and if those institutions certificate. From what the hon. Member were allowed to die, no one would be foolhad said it appeared that he thought those hardy enough to make advances from his certificates should be done away with own private resources again for the purpose altogether. In effect, the hon. Gentleman of re-establishing them. It was quite clear, asked why should we go on expending all that if they went into the market for masthat money in the maintenance of a system ters, instead of applying to the training when they could find masters better or as colleges, the cheapest article would be good in the open market. At all events, taken that was capable of obtaining a grant let them consider, on the other hand, the from the Treasury; and if the hon. Memconsequences of abolishing the require- ber's Resolution should be carried, the nament of certificates. It was completely tional system would go down to the level involved in the hon. Gentleman's propo- of teaching the mere elementary matters sition, on his own showing, that if the pre- referred to in the Motion, and would sink ference given to the certificated master down to the point from which it sprang. were done away with, the training colleges If the views of the hon. Member for Berkwould be destroyed. Neither would young shire were participated in by many Memmen then go to these colleges, nor would bers of that House, they had better not pass managers of schools seek for masters those Resolutions, but make up their minds there, if they were to be more cheaply ob- to trust to the voluntary system exclusively, tained in the open market; and thus a sys- and no longer to waste the public money tem by which a better class of masters in attempting to uphold one the principal were obtained at public expense would feature of which the House was prepared be put an end to. The Royal Com- to dispense with. The right hon. Gentlemissioners, in their original Report, stated man concluded by moving his Amendment. that the most useful application of any sums voted by Parliament would consist in the establishment of normal schools. To leave out from the word "applicable" to the From the earliest proceedings of the Com- end of the Question, in order to add the words, mittee of Council on Education, that had all of them alike, in the way of proportionate been the primary and chief object and aid to voluntary support; subject to the favourthe most successful part of the system; able report of the Inspector, and to tests of at and the Commissioners asserted that it was least elementary instruction being given in them proved beyond all doubt that the trained by teachers in all respects qualified,' teacher was greatly superior to the un--instead thereof. Amendment proposed, "to Schools only of the working classes, but to Question." " trained, and that lowering the standard by Question proposed, "That the words. diminishing the importance of the trained proposed to be left out stand part of the teacher would be a fatal measure. There was not a single country, he might say, in which a system of national education had been attempted, where the establishment of training colleges would not be found to be a principal part of that system, though a most difficult part to rear and maintain. In America, where the whole system of national education was carried out in the most popular manner by rates-even there training colleges existed. They were not supported by rates; for it would be very difficult to get people from year to year to vote large sums of money for institutions the benefit of which was deferred. Still, these institutions existed in every State, and were placed upon endowments in lands and fixed property. If, by passing a Resolution like that before them, the House struck MR. HENLEY said, he felt some difficulty in offering to the House the few observations he had to make, on account of the very curious way in which the Motion of his hon. Friend had been met. Speeches had been made, distinguished by very great ability, as was especially so the speech of the right hon. Gentleman opposite (Mr. Lowe); but every word of that speech, fine as it was, would have been just as applicable to the state of things three years ago as at present. They had been asked, by his right hon. Friend near him (Mr. Adderley), to wait and see how the changes made operated; but the right hon. Gentleman opposite had stated that the number of the unassisted schools had been greatly exaggerated. Now, he did not bring that class of children within the range know whether they amounted to 15,000, of State assistance was a most difficult 12.000, or 10,000; but at all events it was question to solve. For fifteen or sixteen admitted that from 500,000 to 600,000 years the country had been waiting to aschildren were not receiving education in certain the results of the system, and at the assisted schools and private schools. the end of that time they were told by the Now, these children were scattered over Queen's Commissioners that the scheme set the face of the country, many of them up had entirely failed and broken down. A living one, two, or perhaps three miles from great deal had been said about the high the national school. The people, however, quality of the teaching power. It was true, where they lived were taxed at the rate of as far as the masters were concerned, that 1d. in the pound on the income tax for the the teaching power was very great, but unmaintenance of the present system-for that fortunately it lacked one element-it could was what the Education Grant came to not be brought to bear successfully upon the and so far from their being able to get scholars. The Privy Council Office had so any benefit from that grant, their children beautifully moulded the formula intended for were actually shut out by the conditions the information of the House and of the coun of those schools from obtaining any share try, that persons, when they heard that good of the public grant, which the right hon. teaching power existed in such and such Gentleman opposite said ought to be ad- a school, in their ignorance believed that ministered with the greatest care. The the pupils were taught there. When the right hon. Gentleman who last spoke main- Queen's Commissioners went round, however, tained that they were not shut out, but they showed that to be an utter mistake; said that some masters were timid, and and, on the contrary, that the pupils were that the narrow-mindedness of the small not taught at all. Then the right hon. farmers and tradesmen managing the Gentleman, being acquainted with the schools was the cause of the schools losing mysteries of the Privy Council Office, exa share of the public grant. Now, he plained that the phrases used only meant should like his right hon. Friend to pro- that the masters had the power to teach, duce evidence, from which any general but did not do so. The right hon. Gentleconclusion could be drawn, showing how man shook his head; could he deny that many schools were managed by small farm- this was an accurate description of what ers and tradesmen. So far as the Reports had happened? [Mr. LowE: It is quite of the Commissioners and Inspectors were accurate.] Persons who had been assured to be depended on though he certainly for sixteen years that this was the best was not one who placed implicit reliance possible system of popular instruction, and on those reports it appeared that that that nothing, in fact, could be done withclass of persons would not touch the schools out it, went on paying their money contentat all. They held off altogether, and it edly, in the absence of results, believing was difficult to get them to do anything. that by so doing they were conferring enorThey really seemed to think that they mous benefits on their countrymen. But wanted some assistance themselves, with when the Queen's Commissioners reported out giving assistance to others. What he that the system was a total mistake, people wanted to know was, whether they were began to say, "We ought not to be taxed going to meet the difficulty in respect to the any longer, or, at least, we ought to get a 500,000 or 600,000 children he had referred share of the money for ourselves." No," to by lowering the certificate; and if they said the right hon. Gentleman," you shall did so, how long would they be able to not have a clean face if you will not shave keep up the higher certificate? He be with my razor, which I candidly tell you, lieved that the people would all come at the same time, will not cut at all." The down to the lower certificate. Besides right hon. Gentleman had given a de that, there was another difficulty to be en-cription so beautiful that he would not countered. It was not to be supposed that they could go on laying a tax upon the whole community at the rate of 1d. in the pound on the income tax for a system so contrived that it only reached two-thirds of the persons that were wanted to be reached. At the same time, he would admit that the question how they were to VOL. CLXX. THIRD SERIES.] venture to realize it till he saw it in print, of the condition of these pupil teachers at the time when, by the blessing of the Almighty, he came to manage them-of the system as it was established by those great men Earl Russell and Lord Lansdowne, beyond all comparison the best judges of matters of this kind; but he added that 2 R 66 they had since been obliged to cut it down | country some slight benefit from the conto something approaching an every-day tributions which they had been making for level. Now they had got that amended the last sixteen or seventeen years without article, the country was recommended to go on again with perfect contentment, paying its penny in the pound for ever so many years more to open its mouth, in fact, and see what God would send. That was exactly what they were asked to do; and to determine, under the circumstances, what course should be adopted was to solve a most difficult problem. The right hon. Gentleman objected to the phrase poorer schools," and that was not an accurate definition. There were many localities in England with small populations, the number of children ranging from twenty-five to forty, where the difficulty was to get a school at any cost. The right hon. Gentle man said, Why not unite these?" and, applying some term to the clergy which was not complimentary, he urged that they stood in the way of union. He by no means believed that the clergy were the only persons opposed to union; but it must be remembered that the villages where these people lived were scattered often at distances of one or two miles from each other. If little children, eight, nine, or ten years of age had to travel a couple of miles to school every day, trapesing and dragging there under all weathers, in this uncertain climate, and, it might be, sitting in their wet clothes during school hours without the possibility of going home and being fed in the middle of the day, the result would be that children would not go to school at all. That would be the A B C of it. Everybody knew, that when children lived one or two miles away from school, the attendance was most irregular; villages hung together in the same way as counties or countries, and try as they might they could not break up that feeling. The clergy of the country felt very properly that it was part of their duty to look after the education of children; and if the children of three or four parishes were brought into a common school, through providence or improvidence it might happen that there would be four clergymen of extremely different views. In that case he should like to know how the combination proposed by the right hon. Gentleman would be brought about. He believed it would be an absolute impossibility. The effort had been made in many places; but it had never worked successfully. The Motion of his hon. Friend the Member for Berkshire proposed to bring home to parts of the any result. He did not say that he agreed Both his right |