He

MR. ALDERMAN CUBITT wished to explain. He had been misunderstood. begged to represent to the House that the London Committee was left to do the work for four months, during which time the other organization grew up—

MR. SPEAKER said, that the hon. Member might explain, but that he could not reply.

MR. ALDERMAN CUBITT would, then, say only that he had been misunderstood by the hon. Gentleman.

MR. FERRAND said, he wished to put a question to the right hon. Baronet the Secretary of State for the Home Department. He asked him, whether he was not aware that the English Factory Committee of Operatives stated that the body at large was not only opposed to the riotous proceedings of the last few days, but that they had expressed their strongest indignation and their deepest regret at their occurrence. He (Mr. Ferrand) had recently received large numbers of letters from operatives in Lancashire assuring him that no fear need be entertained of any further outbreak, and stating that they looked forward with the greatest interest to the discussion on the subject of the Lancashire distress that was to come off after Easter.

tives in the district. He had, however, see that the Central Committee was using such confidence in the good sense and every possible care in the distribution of good feeling of his constituents, that he the funds committed to their charge. was convinced, that if the parties had been left alone, they would have come to some satisfactory understanding. But just at the wrong moment there came the unfortunate letter-for he must call it so -from the Mansion House Committee, which changed the whole aspect of affairs. He still trusted in the good sense of his constituents, that they would not be led away by certain ill-judged letters and by demagogues who were trying to make mischief. He had entire confidence in the good sense of the operative classes in Lancashire; and notwithstanding the injudicious proceeding-for he could call it nothing else-of the Mansion House Committee, he believed they might look for a peaceful termination of this difficulty. He knew his hon. Friend (Mr. Cubitt) had but one feeling, and that was, a desire to relieve the distress of the operatives; but might he venture to suggest to him how totally impossible it was efficiently to conduct a system of relief if there were two sources of distribution, and if, when for months the Central Committee had given the greatest consideration to the whole subject, it was, from time to time, to be superseded by individuals, who went to the Mansion House Committee and induced that Committee to counteract its proceedings. An attempt was being made to describe the Central Relief Committee and the manufacturers of Lancashire as being bent upon repressive measures in regard to the operatives in the county. Such was not the case; the Central Committee had a very large sum in hand for the purposes of relief, but the prospects were such that they were obliged to act economically. They did not know what the future might be, they had frequently been obliged to make their grants less than they wished; but it was done under an awful responsibility. They felt that they might have to provide for distress at a long distant period when they might not have funds to meet it with. Under these circumstances they took care to husband their resources so as to make the relief as permanent as possible. It happened that they did not always act in accordance with the feelings of the operatives; but if those operatives were not misled by parties who were actuatedhe would not say by bad motives-but by wrong impressions, he believed they would

SIR GEORGE GREY said, the hon Gentleman was quite right in stating that the great body of the operatives throughout Lancashire had taken no part whatever in the riotous proceedings and had given them no countenance. As he had already stated, the disgraceful disturbances were chiefly confined to Staley bridge; and when the excitement extended to other towns, it had been instigated chiefly by persons who had gone there from that place. He was glad to say that the conduct of the operatives as a body was beyond all praise. Nobody could doubt the benevolent intentions of the hon. Member for Andover (Mr. Cubitt), and he was sure the Mansion Ilouse Committee generally were actuated by the best motives. He fully agreed, however, with his hon. and gallant Friend opposite that it was to be regretted that there had been two sources of distribution of relief. As long as these two sources existed, bad consequences would be likely to occur. He concurred with those Gentlemen who had the best means of information, and who had expressed their opinion that the conduct of the Mansion House Com

mittee in regard to Staleybridge was, under [ in the Mediterranean is to be confided to existing circumstances, most injudicious. a Rear Admiral; and whether this appointTheir fault was not in sending the money, ment is rendered necessary by the unfitwhich the hon. Member for Andover ap-ness of the forty-eight active Admirals and peared erroneously to suppose was the Vice Admirals to undertake that command, only alternative to a cold refusal, but in or in consequence of the reluctance of some sending it without communicating with of them to incur the expenses incidental the Central Committee, which comprised to the appointment?. men of great experience and local knowledge, and whose views should have been ascertained.

an agreement between the Commissions of 1862, the Commissioners of 1851, and

Messrs. Kelk and Lucas, that any proposal on that subject could be made. He believed that the Finance Committee of 1851, which was in some sense the organ for such purposes of the Commissioners of 1851, had entertained the question, whether it would be expedient to make a proposal to the Government to take over the building, and might have had, or perhaps

had had some communication with Messrs.

BARRACK-MASTERS.-QUESTION.

to ask the Secretary of State for War, COLONEL FRENCH said, he would beg Whether Barrack-Masters, of late employed as Public Accountants, Bankers, and Lawyers, having charge of Public Property, paying and receiving Rents, undergo any examination as to their fitness to carry out so many professions, never before united is given them by educated clerks or by in the same person; whether assistance men taken promiscuously from the ranks at 28. per diem; and whether the Accountant lately appointed to Pimlico with a very large salary has relieved those officers in Western London of their Financial Duties?

Kelk and Lucas upon that subject on its own account and responsibility, and not at all on the responsibility of the Government. He might also add, that having heard, not formally or officially, but informally and unofficially, what were the views of the contractors, he did not think, so far as he was able to comprehend them, that those views would be compatible with what the Government would think due to the exigencies of the public service or to the justice of the case. That was all he was able to say. On the part of the Go-yers or as bankers. They were not revernment, indeed, he had absolutely nothing to say, and what he had ventured to

say he had said merely to convey to his hon. Friend, in an imperfect form, such

information, if it could be called such, as he possessed as a private individual.

that barrack-masters had always been emSIR GEORGE LEWIS said, in reply, ployed as public accountants, and in that capacity had been intrusted with the duty of paying and receiving rents; but they had never been employed either as law

quired to undergo any examination in regard to their fitness as accountants. They

received the assistance of certain officials, called barrack-clerks, and also of non-commissioned officers, whose pay averaged about 5s. a day. An accountant had With respect to the Question of the hon. lately been appointed at the Pimlico Member for Galway (Mr. Gregory), he believ. establishment, with a salary of £410 a ed the Commissioners of 1862 had prepar-fined to that establishment, and he had year, but his duties were exclusively coned what the hon. Gentleman termed their

final Report, though it was not, strictly speaking, a final Report, because the publication of their final Report would, of couse, involve the winding up of all their concerns. No doubt, however, the hon. Member meant their principal Report, in which they gave an account of the transactions connected with the Exhibition. That Report was prepared, was ready for presentation, and only awaited one or two necessary formalities in order to be laid before Parliament. With regard to the latter part of the Question-whether the Commissioners of 1851 intended to insist on the removal of the present Exhibition building within six months after the closing of the Exhibition of 1862-he was not aware that the Commissioners had come to any absolutely final conclusion upon that subject, but he believed that directions had been given to issue to the contractors a notice requiring them to remove the building, so as to keep alive the full rights of the Commissioners as they stood under the original agreement.

don of their financial duties.
not relieved any officers in Western Lon-

he

EDUCATION REPORTS.-QUESTION. SIR JOHN PAKINGTON said, wished to ask the Vice President of the Committee of Council on Education, Whether the Report of the Rev. Mr. Watkyns last year, and the Reports of other Inspectors in the last two years, have been altogether suppressed or much altered in the Annual Report from the Committee of Council; and, if so, what were the reasons for any such suppression or alteration; and whether there is any objection to lay such suppressed Reports on the table of this House?

MR. LOWE, in reply, said, it was the practice of the Education Committee to lay before Parliament every year, in addition to the Report of the Department itself, and in addition to the tabulated Reports about schools, Reports from the twentyeight Chief Inspectors. In order that those Inspectors might make their Re

ports they were allowed the very ample | which had been sent back to the Inand, he thought, unreasonable period spectors were not amended in a manner of fourteen working days to prepare satisfactory to the Committee of Council, them, the Reports generally not exceeding five or six octavo pages. The result was, that the time of the Inspectors was consumed in preparing their Reports. Considerable difficulty had always been found by the Committee in confining the Reports within what appeared to them legitimate and convenient limits. When the right hon. Member for North Staffordshire (Mr. Adderley) held the office of Vice President, he endeavoured to carry out a scheme for digesting the Reports under heads, as if they were evidence; but the House did not approve that scheme, thinking as the noble Lord now at the head of the Government expressed it, that any Department administered with proper decision and vigour ought to be able to keep down the Reports of its officers without any formal decision of Parliament. Since then the Department had tried to keep the Reports within due limits, and for that purpose several Minutes had been issued, but those Minutes had not fully succeeded in their object. It had also been suggested to the Inspectors that certain paragraphs, thought to be irrelevant or improper, should be omitted, but the Inspectors objected to the omission, because, they said, it was garbling their Reports, and because, if any part were taken away, the Reports would be no longer their own. Under these circumstances, the Committee considered the matter carefully about two years ago, and this was the course they adopted:-They found that, in substance the Minutes previously issued amounted to an instruction to the Inspectors to confine their Reports to the state of the schools inspected by them, and to practical suggestions for their management and improvement, and they embodied that direction to the Inspectors in a new Minute. Then, in order to avoid all difficulty about striking out particular paragraphs, they determined to make the Inspectors their own censors, and the regulation they laid down was this:-Whenever a Report appeared to them to wander beyond the prescribed limits it was to be sent back to the Inspector, with a direction to him to make it conform to the Minute, intimating, at the same time, that if he failed to do so, the Report would not be printed or laid before Parliament. That was the course they had adopted, and the result was, that during the last year three of the Reports

and they consequently were not presented to Parliament. In the present year, also, three of the Reports had been sent back to the Inspectors, and the amendments not having been considered satisfactory, they would not be printed with the Report of the Department. One of the Inspectors, Mr. Watkyns, appeared in both lists. Last year he sent in a Report containing a great deal of speculative and controversial matter, which it was not thought proper by the Committee to lay before Parliament and have printed at the public expense. Mr. Watkyns declined to make any material alterations in his Report, and it was therefore not printed. This year he had sent in a Report likewise dealing with controversial matter; and as that was not thought within the scope of the Minute, the Report was returned to him with the usual intimation; but he declined to make any alteration in it, and for that reason it would not be printed with the Report of the Department. The right hon. Baronet also asked whether he (Mr Lowe) had any objection to lay these Reports before the House of Commons. He trusted the right hon. Gentleman would be convinced by what he had just said that such a course would not be proper. The very reason why he had declined to have them printed with the appendix of the Department's Report, was the very reason why he should decline to have them specially printed and circulated among Members of Parliament. It was desirable to keep the Inspectors, in their Reports on the state of the schools, to the points that had been indicated to them, and not encourage them to enter into speculative and controversial matters on such a delicate subject as education. If he were to consent to lay these Reports on the table, and give them the notoriety and publicity of being specially distributed among hon. Members, he should really be offering a premium to the Inspectors to disregard the rules of the Department, and be thereby striking at the foundation of discipline. He was sure that the right hon. Gentleman, who had held a far higher office than that which he (Mr. Lowe) had the honour of filling, would not wish him to do that.

SCIENTIFIC INSTITUTIONS IN

DUBLIN.-QUESTION.

LORD NAAS said, he wished to ask the

Vice President of the Committee of Council on Education, Whether the Commissioners appointed to inquire into the state of certain Scientific Institutions in Dublin have made a Report; and, if so, whether it will be laid before Parliament?

MR. PEEL replied, that the Report had been sent to the Treasury, and the Treasury had been and were still in correspondence with the Department of Science and Art, and with the Irish Government, and he hoped shortly to be able to lay the Report on the table of the House.

CONCENTRATION OF THE COURTS

be promoted to fill a vacancy now existing; whereas if that vacancy were filled up immediately, another officer would fill it.

SIR GEORGE LEWIS said, in reply, that there would be ample opportunity, during the Session, for bringing forward the Motion of which the hon. and gallant Member had given notice. Under the circumstances of the case, however, he did not feel justified in tendering to Her Majesty the advice which the hon. and gallant Gentleman recommended. He thought the matter had better be left to the discretion of the General Commandingin-Chief.

ADMINISTRATION OF JUSTICE IN

TURKEY.-QUESTION.

OF JUSTICE.-QUESTION. MR. ARTHUR MILLS said, he would beg to ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department, Whether it is the in- MR. AYRTON said, he would beg to tention of Her Majesty's Government to ask the Under Secretary of State for introduce, during the present Session, Foreign Affairs, Whether the Instructions any measure for enabling the Commission- formerly issued by the Secretary of State ers of Works and Public Buildings to ac- for carrying into effect the Order in Counquire a site for the erection and concen-cil for the administration of justice in Turtration of Courts of Justice? key are still in force; and, if so, whether they will be laid upon the table of the House?

SIR GEORGE GREY, in reply, said, it was not the intention of Her Majesty's Government to introduce any Bill for that purpose. The subject of the erection of new Courts of Justice was under the consideration of the Government, and at a later period he would probably be able to give a more definite answer to the hon. Member's Question.

GENERALS OF THE ROYAL

ENGINEERS.-QUESTION.

MR. LAYARD said, the Order in Council relating to Consular Courts in the East was first issued in 1857, accompanied by explanatory instructions. A Report was afterwards directed to be made on the working of the Order; and in consequence of that Report an amended Order in Council was issued in 1860. That was again amended by a fresh Order in Coun cil, issued lately, and placed on the table of the House together with the instructions by which it was accompanied. The previous instructions were no longer operative.

MACHINERY IN COTTON MILLS.

QUESTION.

GENERAL LINDSAY said, he wished to ask the Secretary of State for War, Whether he has any objection to recommend Her Majesty to postpone filling up the vacancy in the establishment of Generals of the Royal Engineers, caused by the death of General Alexander Gordon, until a Motion for an Address to the Crown, LORD JOHN MANNERS said, that he respecting the claims of certain Colonels, wished to ask the Secretary of State for promoted for Distinguished Service in the the Home Department, Whether he is Crimean War, has been submitted to the in possession of any official information judgment of the House of Commons? To showing what progress, if any, has been make his Question intelligible, he would made in adapting the existing machinery beg to say that he had given notice of his in the Lancashire Cotton Mills to the intention to move an Address to the working up of other materials, such Crown respecting the claims ef certain as flax or wool; and, if so, whether he Officers who had been promoted as Queen's will place such information on the table Aides-de-Camp, in 1855, and otherwise, af the House before the discussion takes for distinguished service. Should the place on the Motion which the hon. MemHouse agree to that Address, and the Go- ber for Devonport (Mr. Ferrand) intends vernment adopt the view which he should to bring forward after Easter? put forward, one of those Officers would SIR GEORGE GREY said, in reply,