MR. FERRAND: The noble Lord has the Convention of 1843, but making a disnot answered the latter part of the Ques- tinction between vessels engaged in fishtion. ing. and vessels engaged in trade. They made a distinction between vessels engaged in trading in salt fish, and vessels engaged in the capture of fish. LORD CLARENCE PAGET: It is not the intention of the Admiralty to restore the pensions. FISHERY CONVENTION WITH FRANCE. QUESTION. MR. BENTINCK said, he wished to ask the Under Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs, Whether any, and if any, what steps have been taken by the Government for the re-adjustment of such articles in the Convention with France of 1843 as appear to bear hardly upon our fishermen; and whether it is true that our fishing vessels frequent certain Ports in France for the sale of oysters; and whether the Convention of 1843 is not in contradiction with the Treaty of Commerce of 1860 on that point? MR. LAYARD said, he was happy to inform his hon Friend who had taken so great an interest in this subject that the Government had great hopes that some arrangement would shortly be made with the French Government for the settlement of a matter which had been so long under discussion. He could not, of course, inform his hon. Friend of the steps which were being taken, but they entertained a sanguine hope that some settlement would be arrived at. As regarded the other part of the Question, it was true that, in the early part of last year, the French Government allowed English fishing vessels to sell their fish and oysters in the French ports, and they asked the English Government to allow the French fishermen the same privileges in this country. Our Government were disposed to do so; but it was found that they could not do so without the sanction of Parliament. Consequently they were obliged to refuse the permission, and thereupon the French Government withdrew the permission before extended to the English fishing vessels. Her Majesty's Government, however, entertain hopes that in a short time arrangements will be entered into for enabling the fishing boats of each country to sell their fish in the ports of the other. As regarded the third Question, it was true that there was an apparent contradiction in the articles of the two Treaties; but the contradiction was more apparent than real, the French Government not considering fishing vessels to come under the article of THE GREEK THRONE. QUESTION. would beg to ask, Whether the Under Se- mark to the Throne of Greece? MR. LAYARD said, in reply, that, for lished; and, with respect to despatches, it obvious reasons, telegrams were never pubwould be most inconvenient at the present to lay fragmentary papers on the table of moment, while negotiations were going on, the House. AFFAIRS OF CHINA.-QUESTION. COLONEL SYKES said, he rose to ask the Under Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs, Whether the bodies of the officers, British subjects, attached to Ward's Chinese levies, and killed at the attack upon Tai-tsaing, were recovered; whether it is true, as stated in the Shanghai newspapers, that two pieces of Her Majesty's ordnance were lost at the attack upon Tai-tsaing, which were lent by General Staveley to Ward's levies; and whether Officers of Her Majesty's 31st and 67th Foot, of the Marine Light Infantry, and an Officer of the Royal Engineers, were present at the attack upon Tai-tsaing, which is beyond the thirty-mile radius from Shanghai? MR. LAYARD, in reply, said, he was afraid he could not give his hon. and gallant Friend very full answers to his Questions. It was only that morning that he (Mr. Layard) had received an account of what had taken place, contained in articles from files of the same papers as his hon. and gallant Friend had been consulting. It appeared that an attack had been made by what was called "Ward's Force" on a walled town without the thirty-mile radius, on the authority of a Chinese officer, and against the urgent advice of General Staveley. General Stave HARBOURS OF REFUGE. RESOLUTION. SIR FREDERIC SMITH said, he trust ley appeared to have allowed Captain Holland to accompany the force, fearing that disasters might arise. With regard to the recovery of the bodies of British officers, he had no information on the sub-ed he should meet with the indulgence of ject. Two guns appeared to have been lost, but he (Mr. Layard) was not aware that they belonged to Her Majesty, or whether they had been lent to Ward's force for the purpose of the expedition. Captain Holland was the only officer, he believed, attached to Her Majesty's forces who had accompanied the expedition; but he could not answer his hon. and gallant Friend's Questions so fully as he could wish. THE CASE OF THE "PETERHOFF." QUESTION. MR. BENTINCK said, he wished to ask the hon. Member for London, Whether the statement which appeared that day in the City Article of The Times, with respect to the proceedings of a deputation received on Thursday by Earl Russell, in relation to the seizure of the Peterhoff, and other English vessels, by American cruisers is a correct statement; and also whether a certain document, purporting to be a letter from Mr. Adams to Admiral Du pont, which was quoted in The Times as having been read to Lord Russell, is correctly given? MR. CRAWFORD replied that the statement which appeared in the City Article of The Times, of what took place at the Foreign Office on Thursday, was in terms strictly correct, and that the letter published in the same newspaper as a copy of one read by himself to Lord Russell, and purporting to be from Mr. Adams, the American Minister, to Admiral Dupont, commanding a Federal squadron in the Gulf of Mexico, was, he believed, also in terms strictly correct, though he had not compared it with the original. He wished to add, that he was not a party to the publication of the proceedings of the deputation. SUPPLY. Order for Committee read. Return relative to the British Museum [presented 14th April] referred. Motion made, and Question proposed, "That Mr. Speaker do now leave the Chair." the House while he called attention to the great pains to discharge properly the duty They a larger proportion to the total present employed, having regard to the futuro loss than in the case of property. After welfare of the nation. In June 1860 the a very lengthened inquiry in 1857 and hon. Member for Sunderland (Mr. Lindsay) 1858, the Committee recommended that a brought forward a very important Motion Royal Commission should be sent to in- on that subject, which was very ably arvestigate particular localities along the gued. The words of the Motion were— coast with a view to select the best sites "That in the opinion of this Ilouse it is the for these works. On that recommenda- duty of Her Majesty's Government to adopt, at tion a Royal Commission was accordingly the earliest period possible, the necessary meaappointed, and among its Members was the Commissioners appointed in 1858 to inquire sures to carry into effect the recommendations of that distinguished officer Admiral Sir into the formation of IIarbours of Refuge on the James Hope, who viewed the question Coasts of Great Britain and Ireland." not only with the feelings of a seaman Although it was opposed by the right hon. anxious to save the lives of sailors, but of Gentleman the President of the Board of a statesman desirous of throwing as light Trade, the hon. Member for Montrose, a burden as possible upon the country. and the noble Viscount at the head of the Sir James Hope was the Chairman of the Government, it was carried by a majority Commission. It had also amongst its of 17. The proposition involved the outMembers Admiral Washington, the hy- lay of £4,000,000. What he (Sir Frederic drographer of the navy, who knew more of Smith) now recommended involved not the coasts of Great Britain than any other more than £200,000, and never had such man living; and Captain Sullivan, of the a sum been more beneficially expended. Royal Navy, who occupied an important The Commission had made their Report, post at the Board of Trade, and of whom which had been for some time before the he felt sure that the right hon. President House. Its recommendations were very could not speak in too high terms. There brief. The Commission recommended that was also Mr. Coode, the eminent civil something should be done quickly. Its first engineer, now and for some years past in proposition was, that a harbour should be charge of the works of the harbour of formed at Wick. It was proposed that Portland; the hon. Member for Sunder- Government should contribute £125,000 land, a skilful sailor and a large ship- in constructing that harbour, on condiowner, was also a Commissioner, as well as tion that the locality should raise an Captain Vetch, of the Royal Engineers, in equal amount for its completion. Petercharge of the Harbour Department of the head, also, was to have £100,000, on Admiralty, and himself (Sir Frederic the condition that the locality subscribed Smith). The investigation was conducted £200,000. But he had not heard that that with the view to discover, not the great- sum was raised, and therefore he did not est number of places at which such works include Peterhead in his present proposal. could be carried out, but the fewest con- He should be happy, however, to adopt sistently with the great object in view, the Amendment of the hon. Member for and with a wise principle of economy. It Portsmouth, and to include Peterhead, if occupied eight or nine months In the there was any chance of the money being concluding paragraph of their Report the subscribed. The Commission brought forCommittee of 1858 said, they could not ward two harbours on the Irish coasttoo earnestly press upon the House of Carlingford and Waterford-for each of Commons their strong conviction as to the which £50,000 was asked. He now only necessity, upon national grounds, of these asked one-half, as he did not expect to works being undertaken at as early a get the full amount, and he had selected period as possible, and placed under some Waterford as the harbour on which the system which should secure their steady money should be spent. Douglas, in the and speedy progress. After referring to Isle of Man, was to have £50,000 on conthe large increase in the foreign and coast-dition that the locality raised a similar ing trade of the kingdom during the last sum. No such sum had been raised on fifteen years, the Report went on to say the spot; Douglas was not therefore on that the construction of the works which his list. The Commission recommended the Committee ventured to recommend that St. Ives should have £400,000. was absolutely indispensable to the de- No one could doubt the great advantage velopment of our commerce, and that there of having a harbour there, and he believwas no object for which the public money ed the sum proposed would execute the could be more usefully or more profitably works. But he was not prepared to ask that sum on the present occasion. Pad- Filey was the last of the places which the stow was very important, especially for Commission proposed should be provided the coasting trade. The inhabitants had with a refuge harbour. With respect to laid out a certain sum of money in cutting Padstow, he had received a letter from a off a portion of the bluff headland called gentleman well known in that place, inStippers, which took the true wind from forming him that £40,000 would be vessels entering the harbour. If the Go- ample to complete the necessary works, vernment would spend £40,000 more in and that contracts could be obtained the removal of a further portion of the within that amount. The writer added bluff point, vessels of large size could that the only additional feature in the enter the harbour in safety, and the many case of Padstow, since the issue of the Reshipwrecks which occurred along that in- port of the Royal Commission, was the hospitable coast would be avoided. As great increase in the number of foreign the harbour was examined with great vessels seeking shelter in that harbour, care, and as it was a question of executing and especially of French vessels, which certain definite works for a certain definite were nearly ten times as many as they sum, there was no danger that the esti- were formerly. The neighbourhood of mate of £40,000 would be exceeded. It Padstow, and, indeed, almost from the was recommended that the Tyne should Land's End to Hartland Point, was an ironhave £260,000, provided £750,000 could bound coast, with no refuge whatever be raised in that district; but that sum for the passing trade. The trade of the had not been subscribed, therefore the pro- port itself was in a great degree provided position was abandoned. The sum of for by means of local funds, a portion £100,000 had already been borrowed from of Stipper Point, as already stated, having the Exchequer Loan Commissioners, but been cut away, so that vessels were enabled that was not enough to make the Tyne a to carry in the true wind, and thus avoid, as harbour of refuge. The full sum proposed formerly had been too often the case, being would be necessary, and for that amount driven on the "Doom Bar" Sand, where he was confident an excellent harbour shipwreck was their inevitable fate. What could be constructed. No doubt in this was now proposed would give a certain case, as in all tidal harbours, there was a refuge for the whole of the coasting trade danger of a bar being formed in time, at and a great proportion of the passing its entrance; but according to the late Mr. trade making for the Bristol Channel, and Walker's plan the piers were to be pro- many lives would be saved. It might be jected so far out to seaward that no incon- argued by the President of the Board of venience could be felt from it for a great Trade that the sum required, being so many years. It was proposed that Hartle- small, should be subscribed in the neighpool should have £500,000 if the inhabit- bourhood. But how unreasonable it would ants supplied as much; but he had not be to expect this. Why should the locaheard that such was the case, therefore he lity be taxed, not for its own mere benedid not recommend this sum to be grant- fit, but for the general commerce of the ed. Lastly, it was proposed that £800,000 country? So far as the local wants exshould be laid out on Filey. His hon. isted, they had been supplied by local and gallant Friend the Member for Wake- subscriptions, and all that was now asked field (Sir John Hay) had an Amendment for was to extend, by means of a Parliaon the paper that Filey should be added to mentary grant, and for general purposes, his Resolution. All he could say was, the improvement so well begun by the that if he saw the least chance of carry- commercial men and others of Padstow. ing that Amendment, he should be most Here there could be no fear of the estimates ready to accede to it. He believed Filey being exceeded. The House would hardly to be a most important point. A harbour believe that from 1850 to 1860 no fewer of refuge was much required there, and he than 300 lives were lost on this part of had no doubt a harbour of refuge would the coast, the greater portion of which be constructed at Filey at no very distant would, he believed, have been saved, had period. Not unfrequently as many as previously the small sum now asked for 800 vessels were clustered round Flam- been laid out in the manner proposed at borough Head at one time; and when a this harbour. gale came on, those vessels had to run for the nearest port, some of the laden ships often foundering in the course of the run. The case of Wick was a strong one. The harbour there, as proposed by the Commissioners, would have been one of great capacity, with good anchorage, consisting of two breakwaters, opinion, if it was necessary to defend with an opening 500 feet wide to admit them rather than any other points of the the entrance of large vessels. There was coast, a two or three gun battery would a very large number of vessels passed be amply sufficient. Harbours of refuge at along that coast; but from the Orkneys Wick, Waterford, and Padstow would cost to the Firth of Forth there was not a a comparatively small sum, and would single harbour for them to run into. give in England, Scotland, and Ireland There should be a harbour at Wick or some additional chance of saving the lives Peterhead; but, as he had said, he feared of our seamen. He was sure that he need the money required could not be found say little about the importance of such an at the latter place. At Wick more object. As respects Waterford, it should than 10,000 men were employed at the be remembered that the approach was free fisheries. It was true that some small from danger; there was a bold shore and a projecting piers were about to be con- clean bottom; the entrance was wide, and structed for the benefit of the fishing the harbour offered a large area of sheltered vessels, but those piers would effectually anchorage within; but, as at Carlingford, prevent the formation of any harbour ca- a flat, having only thirteen feet of water pable of being of use to large vessels. over it, obstructed the entrance at low He contended that £125,000 was not a water. If once this could be dredged large sum to expend for so important a away, the cost of which would not exceed purpose as the construction of a harbour £50,000, it was fair to presume the scour which should be accessible to all classes of the daily ebb and flow of the tide would of vessels. Supposing that the country keep the passage clear. Looking at the should be at war with any northern many advantages this harbour offered at Power, where would their cruisers obtain the south-eastern angle of Ireland and stores and coals, or effect repairs? They near the entrance of St. George's Channel, must run through the Pentland Firth, it seemed most desirable that these advanwhere strong north-east winds might be tages should be turned to account; and blowing, or they must run for the Ork- this was the opinion, not only of the Select neys. And let them imagine this country at Committee, but also of the Royal Comwar with America; then they would find missioners. In very early life he himself American cruisers and privateers coming had been wrecked, and the impression on through the Pentland Firth and capturing his mind of what he then saw had never their traders with impunity; whereas, if left him. He felt most deeply for sailors they had a harbour at Wick, they would when exposed to dangers in a position always have a man-of-war attached to the in which there was no refuge at hand; station, ready to protect their commerce. and he appealed to the sympathy and the He considered a harbour at Wick, therefore, commercial instincts of his right hon. an object of great national importance. Friend the President of the Board of A harbour on the east coast was abso- Trade on behalf of these poor men, to the lutely necessary for the preservation of humanity of the Chancellor of the Exchelives and property. The loss of life was quer, and to the patriotism of the noble not diminishing, for he found that in Lord at the head of the Government. He 1856, 1,163 lives were lost on our coasts; was sure that such an appeal would not in 1857, 1,145; in 1858, 1,156; in be made in vain, and he thought that he 1859, 1,416; in 1860, 1,379; and in might safely leave the cause of the ma1861, 1,494. It was said that such a riners of England to the humanity and thing as an old, worn-out collier, like a kind feeling of the hon. Members of the dead donkey, was never heard of, and it British House of Commons. The hon. and was these old colliers that were supposed gallant Member then moved his Amendto founder; but an official Report which ment. had been issued showed that the loss was not in proportion to the age of the vessel The loss of life upon our coast was enormous, the means of saving life were comparatively easy, and he thought it was cnly an act of common humanity to adopt those means. It had been said, that if you built harbours of refuge, you must provide for their defence; but in his MR. KENDALL said, he rose to second the Motion. Perhaps, as a Cornishman, his advocacy of the claims of Padstow might be received with some suspicion, but he contended that a special case could be made out in favour of that place. Padstow was one of the life harbours recommended by the Commissioners; it was situated on an iron-bound coast, where for |