nation, correction, and controul. It was particularly, of the very effence of that houfe, to enquire, to regulate, and to controul; and whenever it was called for properly by the occafion, and that they fufpended, concealed, denied, or refused to exercife that right and duty, then, every object of their meeting and deliberation was at an end; and they were no longer the fervants of the public, or the reprefentatives of the people who had fent them there. The ministers were by no means difpofed to enter into any difcuffion of this fubject; and notwithftanding the connection between the gentleman who had moved the bufinefs and them, it was foon feen that he had acted totally indepen. dent of their opinion and liking, in thus bringing forward the queftion of competence at fo critical a feafon. For although they highly approved of, and openly applauded the doctrine, yet they did not by any means choofe to expofe a question of fuch importance, and which might be fo advantageoufly referved until a proper opportunity offered, to the rifque of an irrevocable decifion, in the prefent flate of things without doors, and of temper, which that ftate of things had produced, within. Nor would the alternative of its being carried in their favour, (a matter, however, of great doubt) be at all more defirable. On the contrary, it would have feemed fraught with great danger. For as the establishment by a vote of the incompetence of parliament, to fuperintend, or interfere, in the civil lift expenditure, would amount to a virtual, if not direct rejection, of the general prayer of the petitions, the poffible confequences of fuch a meafure, feemed of too ferious a nature, to be then thought of without a pause. They accordingly endeavoured to get rid of the queftion as cafily as poffible, without at all bringing it to any decifion. With much applaufe therefore of the doctrine laid down in the propofition, and many compliments to its framer, they, however, declared their averfenefs to the meeting of abftract queftions, and must therefore oppofe the difcharging the order of the day, and the bringing forward of the prefent into difcuffion. They afferted that it could be confidered in no other light than that of a mere abftract queftion, which no man was bound to refolve. That they never could think of difcuffing fuch a queftion, unlefs it clearly arofe from the immediate bufinets before the houfe. That no perfon could fay that was the cafe in the prefent infance. The principle contained in the propofition militated clearly against the principle on which feveral claufes of the bill were founded; the matter of both would come then fairly and naturally before them, when they went into the committee, and came to confider the feveral claufes, Gentlemen then, who difapproved of any claufe, would oppofe it on fuch grounds as appeared to them the moft fure and conclufive; fome on the ground, that the office propofed to be abolished was not an ufelefs one; others, that proofs of the allegations contained in the bill were neceffary; and a third defcription perhaps, that parliament had no right to interfere in the civil lift expenditure, on any other account, than that of notorious abufe. The firft law officer of the crown in that houfe, declared, that he was averfe to the difcuflion of the question, for he could fairly affure them, that if it fhould be put, he did not know whether he hould give it a negative, or an affirmative. The oppofition inftantly perceived the dilemma, in which this propofition had involved the minifters, and at once determined that they fhould not get eafily out of it. Mr. Fox firft feized the occafion, and in a fpeech full of fatire and irony, as well as of ftrong fenfe, highly complimented the right honourable framer of the propofition, for the open, direct, and manly language which he had held. He had delivered his fentiments with that firmness and candour which fo uniformly characterized his conduct in that houfe. He thanked him moft cordially, for the opportunity which it afforded to both parties to come to an iffue. It would fpare much time, and fave infinite trouble. It militated directly against the bill on the table; for certainly, if that houfe was nat competent to enquire into, or controul the civil lift expenditure, the bill was founded in the moft glaring injufice. But while he gave credit for the direct open manner in which the honourable gentleman had declared and fupported his opinion, he muft alfo declare, that it involved doctrines of a moft alarming nature; and which appeared to him to be fubverfive of the first principles of the conftitution. He therefore fincerely hoped, that before the houfe proceeded further, they would confent to let in this propofition; and proceed to discuss it; for it would be e qually nugatory and ridiculous, to go into the committee on the bill, until the fenfe of the house was taken upon that question. It muft be firft got rid of, before any one claufe in the bill could be taken into confideration. He could not at the fame time help declaring, that if it should be refolved and determined, that parliament had not a right to interfere, to reform, to arrange, and, if neceffary, to refume the grants they had made to the crown for public purpofes; in fhort, to fee to the proper application of the monies they had granted; there was at once an end of the liberties of this country. Give princes and their minifters, faid he, the exclufive right of difpofing of any confiderable part of the public treafures, and our liberties, from that inftant, are gone for ever. He denied that the question was abftract, as those who had a mind to get rid of it were pleased to affert. The propofition, as connected with the bill, was no abftract queftion, because it amounted to a direct and specific denial of its principle, which was a thorough reform in the whole of the civil lift expenditure. There was no ground for the other apprehenfion, that the people might be mifled by the declaration. How mifled? Nothing could be a more clear rejection of the petitions, than the fuppofition of the principle in question, fairly propofed by one gentleman, and highly applauded by those who would fain poftpone it. The petitioners fay, that ufelefs and finecure places ought to be abolished; that exorbitant falaries and perquifites ought to be reduced. Where did those evils originate? In the expendi ture ture of the civil lift. Where was the reform recommended, to operate? Moft clearly, where the evil exifted. But the propofition holds that no reform can there operate. It was then evident, that if the propofition fhould appear to be the fenfe of a majority of that houfe, it would comprehend, one or other of these two anfwers to the petitions; that, your petitions are illfounded, and no reform is neceffary; or, that though they are well founded, our hands are fo tied up, that we are incapable of affording you redrefs. He declared, that if the propofition fhould be agreed to, by a majority of that houfe, he fhould confider his toils and labours as at an end; and that as his prefence there could be of no farther ufe or confequence, he never again fhould enter it. Mr. Burke, Mr. Townfhend, General Conway, Mr. Dunning, and other diftinguished members of oppofition, took and fupported nearly the fame ground; diverfifed according to the character and genius of the feveral fpeakers. Mr. Rigby, who introduced the bufinefs, was aftonished at what he called the unaccountable mifinterpretation of words, or perverfion of fenfe, which prevailed on the other fide, in the interpretation which was put upon his propofition. He declared with energy, that he would not readily reign the first place, to any man, who fhould profefs to entertain a more warm and steady zeal for the liberties of his country, than himself; and that it was with no fmall degree of furprize and emotion, he heard fentiments imputed to him, tending to the overthrow of the conftitution. He appealed to all who heard him, whether he had uttered a fyllable, which the most fertile imagination could fo interpret. No man revered the rights of the constitution more, or would go farther in maintaining the rights of the people, within that house, where only, in his opinion, fo long as parliament exifted, they could be conftitutionally defended. He maintained the right of the people to petition every branch of the legiflature; but it was in that houfe only, that their voice could be fairly known and acknowledged; and from thence only it could be furely and fafely collected.-He ftill adhered firmly to his original opinion, and to the propofition founded upon it; and notwithftanding the difficulty in which the queftion involved administration, fupported the oppofition in their intention of bringing it to a decifion; declaring, that as he would not be bullied out of his propofition by one fide of the houfe, fo he was refolved not to be flattered or cajoled out of it by the other. The friends of adminiftration endeavoured all they could to foften, and in fome measure to explain away, the apparent fenfe and meaning, or at least that in which it had been firft understood, of the propofition. Nor did they only attempt to refcue it from the fenfe put upon it by their adverfaries but likewife from fome part of that, which had in the beginning drawn forth applaufe on their own fide. They infifted, that it did not by any means involve in it a denial of the right to reform abufes; but that it only afferted, that it would be unjust to interfere in the civil lift expenditure, without proper proof of abuse, previ ous to the interference. And this maxim, they faid, was fupported by the conftitution; admitting the right to exift, in the ftrongest manner in which it had been stated or fuppofed on the other fide. But as the purport of the propofition had already been mifconceived or mifreprefented within doors, there could be no doubt, that it would be much more mifconceived, and mifreprefented, out of doors. And they could not help faying and thinking, that the eagerness fhewn to bring the right honourable gentleman's propolition under difcuffion, could proceed from no other motive, than that if the house fhould agree to it, it might furnifh grounds for fpreading falfe rumours, and creating popular delu fion. This change of ground, produced fome awkward fituations and circumstances, which afforded room for laughter and farcafm on the other fide. As to limiting the right of controul, to the previous proof of abufe, it was faid to be ridiculous. How was the abufe to be discovered or proved, but by exa. mination and enquiry? If parliament was competent to the correction of an abufe, they must be competent to the means of its difcovery. To talk of any power of controul, without that of enquiry, or of enquiry without that of con-, troul, was too abfurd to deferve an anfwer. The fuppofed injuftice of enquiry, before the proof of abufe, was, if poffible, more fo; and could be only equalled by the fappofition, that although a man ought to be punished for the commition of a crime; yet it would be unjust to try him, until his guilt was proved. The queftion now before the houfe, and on which both parties were to bring forward their utmost force, was, whether, according to the order of the day, it fhould be refolved into a committee on Mr. Burke's bill, or whether they fhould first enter into a difcuffion of, and decide upon, Mr. Rigby's propofition. The question being put about nine o'clock, the refolution for the order of the day was carried, by a majority of fix only, the numbers being 205, to 199. This divifion was marked by the fingular circumftance, of Mr. Rigby's voting in the minority, and in oppofition to all his friends in adminiftration. The first claufe in the bill, and confequently the first queftion before the committee, was that for abolishing the office of third fecretary of State, otherwife fecretary for the colonies; which was after wards modified to the fimple defcription of one of his majefty's principal fecretaries of state. Much of the ground, which we have formerly had occafion pretty accurately to mark out, on the applications of the crown to parlia ment, for the discharge of the civil lift debts, and for an addition of revenue to that establishment, and which we have fince likewife feen not unfrequently trodden upon other occafions, was now again gone over by both parties'; and its principal pofitions ftrongly and warmly difputed. The tenure by which the crown held the civil lift revenue, was again agitated; the friends of adminiftration confidering it as a life eftate; as exclufive and private property. The right of parliament to interfere at all, and in any cafe, in its difpofal or expenditure, expenditure, was rather doubtfully fpoken of by the moft guarded and temperate, who paid fome attention to the tenderness and difficulty of the ground; but others, particularly fome in high office, abfolutely denied it, without qualification or referve. But if the right of interference were admitted, the minifters contended, that it must be in cafes of grofs abufe, previoufly and incontrovertibly proved. When that was once done, that houfe was undoubtedly competent to point out to the fovereign, the proper mode of removing and correcting them; but that mode was not by paffing a law of refumption; an extremity, which if at all reforted to, it should only be in fome cafe of the laft neceffity, when all other means had been tried, and had been found ineffectual. But even fuppofing that it were right and fit for parliament to interfere upon motives of public œconomy, another queftion would arife, whether the object to be attained, namely the faving propofed, was of that magnitude to justify the houfe, not only in an innovation, but in the fuppreffion of an ufeful and neceffary office. For in the contemplation of the committee, it must be deemed an ufeful and neceffary office, until the contrary was clearly proved. They were not to estimate the office that was propofed to be abolished, merely upon its own intrinfic value; but they were likewife to confider what the measure of abolishment led to. The claufe before them, formed but a part, and a very fmall part indeed, of the multifarious bill to which it belonged. But if the propriety of this claufe fhould be eftablished, the fame principle would reach to every other part of the bill; and its effects would be extended to all the branches of the royal houfhold, and even disturb the domestic arrangements within the palace. But confidering the clause merely upon its own proper ground, and fuppofing the bill to be formed on the fentiments contained in the petitions, would any gentleman venture to declare that the office was a finecure; that it was attended with exorbitant fees, perquifites, or emoluments; that it was a heavy, expenfive establishment; or, that it was a fource of much influence in that house. It perhaps would be faid, that it was ufelefs and unneceffary. If that ground is taken, let the gentlemen on the other fide bring forward their evidence; let them demonftrate to the committee that it is fo; but let not affertion pafs for proof, nor mere opinion for argument. It will then be incumbent upon them to establish the right, as well as the expediency of interfering, and of refuming the grant made to the fovereign on his acceffion; a grant which he received as an equivalent for that ample revenue, to which he was entitled, from the inftant of his being proclaimed king of this country; and they will still be called upon to thew, that the reform is not only juft and neceffary, but that the mode propofed, is the only one, or the beft, which could poffibly be carried into execution. They expected, they faid, to hear it obferved, that the abolishing of the office in queftion would be no innovation, as it was only of modern date, and of a few years ftanding; but to provide against |