made of the bill for the more effectually officering the militia, as if not, it might be a reafon against its revival.

Mr. Secretary Yorke replied, that whatever might have been the ufe made of the bill, it was neceffary to revive it, in order that the militia might be properly officered. The returns of the number of officers appointed under the bill might be easily obtained.

The Chancellor of the Exchequer gave notice, that he should on Wednesday fe'nnight move the ways and means for raising the fupply of the year.

IRISH MILITIA.

Mr. Secretary Yorke moved the third reading of the Irish militia offers bill.

Mr. Kinnaird made fome objections to the bill and to the mode of augmenting the militia, which, as it was kept on foot at the expence of both kingdoms, ought to be for the defence of both. He concluded by urging the neceffity of energetic measures at the prefent crifis.

Mr. Lee expreffed himself strongly in favour of an imperial militia, conceiving that there was no found reafon for locking up a certain number of militia in England or in Ireland exclufively. He thought that all diftinctions upon this fubject ought to be done away, as fo long as the militia of the two countries remained diftinct, fo long Ireland was deprived of a part of thofe advantages which ought to refult from the union. He ftated that befides the 6000 of the Irish militia who appeared in the paper on the table, he understood that three regiments more had fince volunteered their fervices in the fame way.

Mr. Bankes repeated his former objections to the measure, for which he conceived that no neceflity had been made out, nor could he perceive that by taking away 10,000 militia from Ireland, any number of men could be got for general fervice.

Mr. Windham referved his opinion on the general fubject, until the bill which had been poftponed fhould be brought forward. What he rofe for in the prefent inftance, was to throw out an idea, which he thought neceffary for him on this occafion, left he should be fuppofed to acquiefce in sen-, timents from which he differed, although his general opinion was in unifon with the hon. Gentleman who uttered them. What he meant applied to that which was commonly called

the

the love of our country: by that he neither meant that which embraced the general interefts of the world, as they might be viewed by fome, nor that contracted policy which was adopted by others, although he admitted that fome of the bett principles that a man cherished in fociety, arose from local attachment for the country, as the particular (pot that gave him birth. This attachment, although local and contracted, led to many generous acts; but still he would not have it preffed too far, fuch as to make a man attend to the particular intereft of Sufiex inftead of Kent, or any thing of that nature; he wished for fomething more liberal,and that Gentlemen fhould take a view of the true interefts of the British empire, not of England in contradiftinction to Ireland, nor Ireland as different from England, but of the general and united intereits of both. Not that he wished to be understood to bind himself to any broad general principle applicable to all cafes of this nature, for he knew how many virtuous fentiments originated in what might properly be called local prejudices; for attachment to the fpot which gave a man birth, or that in which his ancestors had made great achievements, or the like, was of that character, and in one sense was the love of one's country altogether, for that was to prefer its intereft to that of the rest of mankind. He therefore wifhed, that in judging of the intereft of the British empire, Gentlemen would confider as much as they could the cafe of England and of Ireland as one and the fame thing. He thought it neceffary to make thefe few obfervations, at the fame time. that he retained his opinion on the general military fyftem which Minifters had adopted for both parts of the empire.

Mr. Secretary Yerke approved of every fyllable uttered at that time by the right hon. Gentleman who had juft fat down, upon the fubject of the love of our country, and he deprecated the practice of endeavouring to fet off one part of the empire against the other in intereft, for that was directly hoftile to the true fpirit of the union between Great Britain and Ireland, an event from which he expected great benefits to arife, as we had felt from the union between England and Scotland. He proceeded to defend the bill then before the Houfe, and adverted to the arguments which had been urged againfi it, maintaining the propriety of the measure altoge ther upon general principles.

Lord Folkeftene objected to the general principles of the bill.

Sir John Newport obferved upon the militia fyftem in

general,

general, of which the prefent measure was a branch. He faid he had no intention of calling in queftion the purity of the motives of thofe gentlemen who had entered into certain refolutions on the fubject of the militia volunteering to go out of their own country into another part of the empire. He confidered thofe noblemen and gentlemen as perfons of pure honour and perfect integrity, who acted from the moft unquestionably virtuous feelings, whether they were correct in judgment or not. He faid he thould give a vote that night different from that which he gave on a former occasion upon this bill, which arofe from an understanding, that no provifion was at all intended to be made for an interchange of the militia of the two countries; and he trusted, at all events, if any part of the militia of Ireland was to be called out of that country, they would not be replaced by foreigners. He took occafion to obferve upon the union between this country and Ireland. He thought that measure had not been fairly treated, it had not yet had any thing like a fair trial. Those who planned it, and from whofe talents and exertion both countries moft juftly expected much for the general advantage of both parts of the empire, had not hitherto been able to act as could have been withed; and until fome meafures came from thofe eminent perfons according to their fenfe of the utility of the union, and the true fpirit of it as a measure of general policy for the intereft of the empire, the union could not be faid to have been fairly tried. He muft be allowed alfo to fay it appeared to him to be impolitic to bring forward from day to day thofe meafures which applied only to particular objects, and the provifions of which were of a local and temporary nature. He wished to fee fome broad, general and permanent lyftem adopted equally applicable to each part of the united empire, fo as to confolidate the interefts, conciliate the hearts, and meet the withes of both fides; but he could not help faying that a great deal of the advantages the empire might have derived from the good wishes of leading men, had been done away by the firebrands of difcord of late employed in Ireland.

Mr. Secretary Yorke explained what he had formerly faid on the subject of the army of referve.

Mr. Fox faid, that his reafon for rifing then was, to take notice of what had just fallen from an Lon. Member behind him (Sir John Newport). He was glad he vederstood the" hon. Member as to what he had faid on a former night, for he had thought he had caft reflections on thofe noblemen and gentlemen

gentlemen who figned the refolution alluded to, relative to the militia going out of this country. They were characters of the highest clafs, and for whom he profeffed to have very warm attachment; and as he now understood the hon. Mem ber did not mean to express himself in the way he (Mr. Fox) then understood he had done, all he would fay was, he was forry he had misunderstood him, and he begged his pardon. As to the debate of that night, it had, as on fome other occafions, been fashionable to go into extraneous matter; but he fhould not follow the example; there were many points stated which he fhould not difcufs; but on the point of the love of his country, he must fay that he was between the two extremes, neither defirous that local attachment fhould check general fentiment, nor that general fentiment fhould wholly deftroy local attachment. It was true that Parliament, as such, mult confider the two countries, England and Ireland, united in interefts as one individual country; but while they were legiflating on a meafure fo local in its nature as that of the militia was, they must confider what were the difpofitions of the people of each country, and poffibly particular fpots in each country. So that the Houfe was not, in this cafe, to confider the act of Parliament upon general principles, without re gard to local attachment; and here came a difference between the friends and the enemies of the union; the one wished to diminish, the other to increafe thefe local attachments, and the prejudices arifing out of them; nor was it to be at once cured. It was true the act of union declared the two countries to be joined as one, but it was not by acts of Parliament, but by habits that men felt; it was not by the ftatute of the 6th of Anne or the 40th of George that men regulated their feelings; these were not the rules by which we diftinguished between an Englishman and a Scotchman, or between either of them and an Irishman; nor could they change. a man's preference for the county of Suffex to that of Kent. Thefe things depended upon habits, which could not be haftily done away. But there was a part of this bill that appeared to him to require amendment. If we brought into England 10,000 Irifh militia, we fhould have among them a great number of catholics; they were all under the difcipline of the mutiny bill, and chiefly if not wholly proteftant officers. It was a part of military difcipline to oblige men to go to church. One would not think that this power would be ufed for the purpose of oppreffion, and he hoped not, but he fubmitted that either a claufe fhould be introduced into this

bill,

bill, or else a new bill fhould be brought in, in which provi fion thould be made, by which these catholics should not be compelled to follow the protestant form of worship against their fcruples of confcience.

Sir L. Parfons obferved there was nothing in the articles of war by which they were compelled to do this. He then proceeded to obferve on the union of the two countries: Gentlemen feemed to confider Ireland as if it were another and remote country beyond the Atlantic-whereas the true way to confider that matter was to confider the channel between England and Ireland as a mere canal, by which a communication was to be conftantly kept up between them. Upon the measure now before the House, he was a friend to it, nor could he omit this opportunity of obferving that Ireland was never better taken care of by fea or land than at the prefent time; which was not the cafe in every instance in the time of the late Administration, the particulars of which, although he could, he would forbear to state.

Mr. Wm. Smith obferved, that Irish Gentlemen appeared to him to accede to this measure under the idea that it was to be reciprocal, and that fimilar offers were to be made by the English militia. He wished the Houfe to confider to what length that idea, if indulged, might go. He thought we fhould not try any thing of this kind without a general revifion of the militia law, and an alteration of a permanent nature for the future; but all the prefent militia muft be allowed to remain as they are, for Parliament could not, confiftently with its honour, operate upon them by an ex poft facto law. He thought this bill objectionable on the ground that it would increase the price of fubftitutes, which was a tax, on account of men being unwilling to enter where the nature of the service was extended. But above all, confidering the character of the Government with which we had to contend, not only now, but the Government which France might affume if they should be fo happy as to part with its prefent head, he thought it was well worth the while of the Houfe to confider whether we should not adopt a different fyftem for our defence in future, although hitherto we had been indeed happy in that fyftem,

Lord Proby was againft the bill.

Colonel Craufurd entered into fome general obfervations on the bill, and proceeded to propofe an amendment, the object of which he faid was, to put an end to that ftate of deliberation in which the prefent bill placed the militia.

He