MR. CRIPPS wished to ask whether the fourth Bill would limit the power of the judges of the local courts to entertain actions for unliquidated damages? He did not know whether the Attorney General had heard any complaints upon the subject; but it was becoming a common practice to bring actions against magistrates, for the mere purpose of harassing them, for what the parties were pleased to call illegal commitments, laying their damages under 20l. He (Mr. Cripps) knew of three most respectable and highly intelligent magistrates who were on the point of sending in their resignations, simply because they had been harassed with actions, in which, although they had succeeded in gaining verdicts, they were put to 157. or 207. expense, and worried for merely doing their duty. the House should concur in his suggestion | ing the indecorum of holding petty sessions to refer the Bills to a Select Committee, in public-houses, it would be a very great a complete code of laws upon this point improvement; the only fear was, that the might be framed. He had adopted the expense, considering the existing charges same course with regard to the duty of upon counties, might hinder its coming magistrates in cases of summary convic- very speedily into operation. He (Sir J. tions, collecting in a second Bill all the Pakington) might say the same with restatutes, and embodying also in it the gard to the payment by salaries. But if various decisions of the courts, and append- he could render any assistance in forwarding a schedule of forms and precedents. ing the objects in view, he should do so In these two Bills he had endeavoured to with great pleasure. introduce nothing new; the House, if they should think fit hereafter to make any improvement in the law upon the subject, could do so, but his object had been simply to collect together the enactments and decisions forming the existing law upon these heads. The third Bill comprised the provisions applicable to the holding of special and petty sessions, and in that Bill there was some new matter. It would enable the magistrates of the county, if they should think right, to provide fitting places, at the expense of the county, for holding sessions; for he thought it highly inexpedient that they should be held at publichouses, where the witnesses and others must be exposed to great temptations. It would also enable the magistrates in county sessions, if they should think fit, to pay the magistrates' clerk by a salary; and as that payment was to come from the county rate, he proposed to retain the power of receiving fees with the county, and the power of dispensing with them in certain circumstances, but with a further provision, authorising the Secretary of State, in concurrence with the magistrates, to frame one uniform scale of fees to be in operation through the whole of England. The fourth Bill contained a collection of the laws applicable to the protection of magistrates. These matters not being subjects of political importance might not be interesting to many, and, unaided by hon. Gentlemen on both sides of the House, he (the Attorney-General) could not hope to succeed in this undertaking; but he should propose to allow a Session to intervene before going into Committee on the Bills, and then he trusted he should have the assistance for which he looked. At all events, he felt that he was taking a step in the right direction. The ATTORNEY GENERAL had not heard of any complaints of this kind, and had not introduced in these Bills any provision upon the subject; his main object was to consolidate the law, remedying also some defects and difficulties that had arisen in the construction of the statutes; it would be for the House to consider hereafter whether any new enactments should be added of the nature alluded to. He ought to have mentioned that he had placed in the margin references to the books of authority where the present law was to be found; if the forms of the House would allow him to circulate the Bills in that shape, it would be very convenient. MR. HUME suggested that all the references should be appended in a sheet at the end of the Bill. With regard to the question of the hon. Member (Mr. Cripps), he (Mr. Hume) must say, that if the public were not to have the protection of the SIR J. PAKINGTON, though, of course, law, or of the dread of the law, against not pledging himself to the details of improper proceedings of justices of the these measures, could not refrain from ex- peace, the Government ought to adopt pressing his thanks to the hon. and learned some rule that should prevent any one Gentleman for his most praiseworthy effort. being appointed a justice till he had been If arrangements could be made for prevent-examined and was known to be qualified to act as such. He was opposed to all un- SUGAR AND COFFEE PLANTATIONS. redress is being discussed in a Committee up-stairs, these great interests will perish. They say to me that a Committee of Inquiry will be to them of the nature of that comfort which "Like cordials after death, comes late;" and that before the Committee shall have reported, the West Indian interest will be altogether past recovery. But, Sir, it is for me to consider what my power is to obtain any substantial relief by a direct vote of this House; and when I remember that in July, 1846, I moved a resolution of this House, the purport of which was to maintain the protection for the West Indian and East Indian free-labour colonies, which they now seek, and that I had but 130 Gentlemen to support me, whilst 265 votes were recorded against me in favour of the measure of Her Majesty's Ministers admitting slave-labour sugar, I feel that it is hopeless for me to endeavour in this House-where I have no reason to suppose any addition has been made to the Members acquiesing in my views of protection-to convert that minority to a majority; and more especially when I recollect that on that occasion but five Gentlemen connected with the West Indian and East Indian interests recorded their votes with me, I think the West Indian interests have not a good case against me when they blame me for not taking a more resolute step on this occasion. I need not say for myself-I doubt not I may say for those 130 Gentlemen who supported me in the year 1846-that they require no Com LORD G. BENTINCK: Sir, if I consulted my own wishes, aware as I am that the Motion I am about to propose will receive no opposition from Her Majesty's Ministers, I should much prefer to make no statement on this occasion; but I be-mittee of Inquiry to convince them of the lieve I should not be consulting the general wish of the House, or the wishes of those who are deeply interested in the produce of the sugar-cane, if I were to make this Motion for a Committee of Inquiry without some preliminary observations. It has been represented to me by many of those who are interested in Her Majesty's colonies in the East and West Indies-it has been represented to me, from those colonies, and from persons in this country who are interested in them, that the course which I am proposing is not consistent with the necessities of this case; that there is something pusillanimous in the Motion which I am going to bring before the House; that, in point of fact, the West Indian interest and the interest of the Mauritius and the East Indies, connected with sugar and coffee planting, are in extremis, and that while the question of their necessity of some immediate and some substantial relief to the sugar-planting interests under the British Crown; but in proposing this inquiry I wish it to be distinctly understood that I do not seek to preclude either myself or any other Member-if any substantial measure for immediate and effectual relief should be brought forward-from supporting that measure, or from pledging themselves to support any such proposal. But, Sir, looking as I have done at the deplorable state of the West Indies, the East Indies, and the Mauritius, and holding as I do in my hand a list of forty-eight great houses in England — twenty-six of the first commercial houses in London, sixteen in Liverpool, and six elsewhere-which have failed, and whose liabilities amount in the whole to 6,300,000l. and upwards, none of which, I believe, would have fallen if it had not been for the with Spain in particular under the Treaty of Utrecht, admit foreign free-labour sugar, and exclude slave-grown sugar. I shall not now rediscuss that question. I retain my opinion, that we were fully justified by the Treaty of Utrecht in making the distinction between the two kinds of sugar. When, however, the Ministers of the Crown-when the noble Lord opposite the Member for London, and the noble Lord the Foreign Secretary, proclaimed that, in their opinion, that distinction could not be maintained, consistently with good faith or the honour of the Crown, I knew that such a distinction could not be enforced without the dismissal of those Ministers from the service of the Crown who had maintained, in the face of foreign Powers, that such a distinction could not be made consistently with the honour of the country. Whatever, therefore, may be my opinion on this point, I, for one, am not prepared, on so trifling a ground as the admission of some 20,000 or 30,000 tons of free-labour sugar, to attempt to force a change of policy, which must, if I were successful, overthrow the Government. ruin brought upon them by the change in | stood. In that case the dispute was, whethe sugar duties, and the consequent reduc- ther or not we could, consistently with our tion in the price of their produce-I do hope treaties with slaveholding countries, and that through the intervention of a Committee of this House, I may be able to prevail upon the House to change its policy with regard to this great question. The right hon. Member for Manchester, the Vice-President of the Board of Trade, has stated elsewhere that he considers the account between this country and the West Indies to have closed in 1833, when this country made a grant of 20,000,000l. of compensation money to the slaveholders in our colonies. I hope, however, to be able in the course of this discussion to show, that, though this compensation does appear on the first blush to have been most liberal, it has in reality proved to be no compensation at all for the losses which the proprietors in the West Indies and the Mauritius have sustained. And, Sir, it must be borne in mind that this compensation, accompanied by the measure of emancipation, was in a manner forced upon the proprietors of slaves in our colonies, and was not the result of any compact or bargain with them. I am well aware that the feeling against slavery has very much subsided since the time when the whole nation was in a state of excitement against the continuance of slavery in our colonies. I am well aware that that high sentiment of Christianity and religion which inspired the nation almost as one man for many years previous to 1833, has comparatively become dead, and the desire for cheap sugar has overcome all regard for freedom and abhorrence of slavery. I cannot, for one, be blind to the fact, that at the last general election not one single word was uttered in any quarter against slavery and the slave trade; and that those parties who were omnipotent in the election of 1832 had become altogether silent and powerless in the election of 1847. Though I retain my opinion that we are bound in honour and good faith to exclude from this country slave-grown sugar, I feel it would be useless for me to propose any measure for that purpose; yet if such a measure should be proposed, I shall be ready and willing to support it. There is another measure which I have supported on former occasions. I mean the measure for the admission of foreign free-labour sugar, to the exclusion of slave-grown sugar, with regard to which I think the House now stands in a position far different from any in which it has hitherto Sir, the West Indian proprietors ask, in all their petitions, for several things. They ask for the exclusion of slavegrown sugar-for differential duties-for the free admission of molasses into the breweries and distilleries of this country- for the admission of rum on an equality with British spirits-for the repeal of the navigation laws-and for free access to the coasts of Africa, and elsewhere, for the purpose of obtaining free labourers wherever they think fit. With respect to the navigation laws, I shall state at once that I cannot go along with them in supporting their repeal; and I must further take leave to say that, in my opinion, it is most inconsistent on the part of the West Indian and East Indian interest to ask protection for themselves, and to deny or seek to deprive other interests of the protection they enjoy. I recollect when the noble Lord opposite introduced his measure for the alteration of the sugar duties to the House, he said that protection must travel in a circle-that the circle was a vicious one-and that protection to the West Indies was a part of that vicious circle which he was disposed to recover. I agree with the noble Lord, that protection must go in a circle-that you cannot give protection to one and refuse it to another; but, so far as the West Indies are concerned, I am at a loss to understand how they can expect to derive any benefit from the repeal of the navigation laws. I know that a letter has been written by one "Jacob Omnium," who has now, however, cast off his disguise; and in that letter it is stated that while freights from St. Croix to this country were only 37. 10s. a ton, the freights from Demerara were 61. a ton. Assuming that the navigation laws could create such a difference, which however is not the fact, I want to know what benefit it would be to the West Indian interest if the navigation laws were repealed, unless they mean that they are to be repealed only so far as they themselves are concerned, but to be enforced as regards the rest of the world? But suppose the repeal of the navigation laws would reduce freights from 61. to 31., as between Jamaica, Demerara, and Great Britain, I ask, would not their repeal have exactly the same effect as regards Cuba and Brazil? Six-sevenths of the whole trade between this country and Brazil and Cuba are carried on in British vessels; and to all intents and purposesso far as the navigation laws are concerned therefore the trade to Brazil is as much a close trade, and as much of a monopoly, as the trade with any British colony. If the repeal of the navigation laws would reduce freights from 67. to 31. between Jamaica and England, and between Demerara and England, would it not equally reduce freights from Brazil and Cuba to England? The repeal of these laws, therefore, might possibly cheapen freight, but it would do so equally with regard to the slave-grown sugar of Cuba and Brazil as with regard to the free-labour sugar of the British colonies. As this cry has come from the West, and not from the East Indies, let me remind them that the freight to this country from Demerara has never been 67. a ton, as stated by "Jacob Omnium," except for a moment when the "times were out of joint. But supposing the freight from the West Indies to be 67., the freight from the East Indies, from Java, and the Mauritius, at corresponding rates, would be at the least 121. If the West Indian interest, therefore, imagine that the repeal of the navigation laws would reduce their freights to England 31. -than which supposition nothing can be more ridiculous-I must remind them that the repeal which reduced their freights 31. a ton, would at the same time reduce the freight from the East Indies and Java 67. a ton; and I should like to know what the West Indies would gain by a change which would reduce the freight from Brazil, Cuba, Mauritius, Calcutta, and Java, in the same proportion that it would reduce freights from Jamaica to this country, whereby the Eastern hemisphere would gain 67. per ton where the West Indies gained but half that sum? I have, however, a number of statements by me from those most qualified to give correct information on this subject, and I find that freights in the early part of the year from Jamaica were from 31. 10s. to 41. 48.; from Demerara, not 6l., as alleged, but from 27. 10s. to 31.; and from Barbadoes and Trinidad, 37. 10s. to 31. 15s. By the last advices from Pernambuco and Bahia, I observe that the freights by English vessels were lower than those of other vessels. True it is that freights from Cuba are lower than from Jamaica; but at Cuba the ship runs up alongside the wharf, and there is no droggerage to pay. In Jamaica the sugar is brought to the port of shipment in small boats at the charge of the shipowner, the freights on the north side of the island ranging much higher than those on the south side generally 158. a ton. At Demerara the freights are as low as from any other sugar-growing country in the world. I think, then, I have disposed of the question of the navigation laws so far as the West Indian interest is concerned. I come now to the question of the admission of rum on an equality with British spirits. Upon this point I hold the same opinion which I maintained last year. If the West Indian interest can prove that an equality in name is an equality in equity and justice, I am quite ready to admit rum at the same duty as that laid on British spirits. But my opinion is, that when the justice of the claim comes to be inquired into, the British distillers will be able to show that, so long as Excise restrictions are imposed upon them, from which the rum distillers are exempt, the present differential duty is no more than equity and justice require. That is my present opinion; but I will go into the Committee with an honest desire to come to a just decision on the question. With respect to the introduction of molasses into breweries and distilleries, that is an affair between the West Indian interest and the Chan cellor of the Exchequer; though I do not | House in the debates of 1833. He know whether the admission of molasses statedwhich they claim would very much benefit the West Indian proprietary. "That for one shilling sterling of daily wages, free labourers would work in Porto Rico from sunrise to sunset, and on a moderate calculation would perform more work during that time than two slaves would perform." "That in the year 1828, 1,437,285 acres of land in Porto Rico, were held by 19,140 proprietors. At the same time, 423 individuals were proprietors of estates worked by slaves. Of these 275 were devoted to the production of sugar, and 148 were other plantations. In 1822, there were but 29 sugar estates, and the value of the sugar exported annually amounted to 57,000 dollars; but in consequence of the liberal conduct of Governor Le Tone, great encouragement was given to sugar planting under his administration, and a considerable immigration took place into this island.” The great question of immigration comes next. Some of the West Indians, who live in Demerara, Berbice, and Trinidad, imagine that by the free immigration When Colonel Flinter wrote, the exports of labourers they can compete with all of sugar from Porto Rico only amounted the world; and I am disposed to say, that to 20,000 tons. Now, the exports from the British planters should have every the same place, for the year 1847, up facility afforded them for obtaining labour to the 10th of December, amounted to wherever they can get it, so long as they 49,000 tons. But how has this been ardo not trench upon slave trading; but if rived at? Is it by free labour that these the Demerara people can, as they say, results have been obtained? No such by the importation of some 100,000 or thing. I hold in my hand an extract from 150,000 labourers, produce 400,000 tons a work, the truth of which, I believe, will of sugar yearly, the effect will be, that be confirmed by a Gentleman now in this they will altogether swamp the old colo- House; it is an extract from a work writnies of the Crown. But though I think ten by Mr. Macgregor. That Gentleman that no unfair advantage should be given statesto one colony over another, I doubt very much whether any free labour can enable the planters to compete with slave labour; or whether any amount of free labourers will so beat down wages as to enable the free-labour sugar planters to compete with those who employ slave labour. I would ask the West Indian how it is that in Barbadoes, which is more thickly populated than China-which has 750 persons to the square mile, and whose population is three times as dense as that of Ireland, and nearly three times as dense as the population of England-which is more dense than any other spot in the habitable world, unless it be Malta-I want to know how Barbadoes by any importation of Africans can be made to compete successfully with the slave-grown sugar of Cuba and the Brazils, on even terms, when with a 6s. duty in their favour it is unable, notwithstanding its dense population, to compete now? I believe there is no example of any country being able with free labour to compete with the labour of slaves. I have heard it said, that Porto Rico is an example of this kind. But the sugar planting in that country is almost entirely done by means of slave labour. The exports of sugar annually from Porto Rico have never exceeded 49,000 tons; but such as it is, the business is carried on by the labour of slaves. I am aware, indeed, that Colonel Flinter, writing at Madrid eighteen years ago, gives a different account; but since that we have had very contrary opinions expressed on the subject. I know that what Colonel Flinter wrote in 1830, was constantly quoted as an authority in this Mr. Macgregor further says "That the planters from the neighbouring islands of St. Croix and St. Thomas brought their slaves to Porto Rico, and that in consequence of the introduction of these slaves, and the capital possessed by their owners, the island had constill continues to be, a very considerable source of tinued to prosper since 1828, and had been, and revenue to the mother country." So far, therefore, from this being an island where the cultivation of sugar has advanced by free labour, this rapid insult of the encouragement given to slavecrease in its prosperity has been the reowners in other places, to induce them to settle at Porto Rico. But if this evidence which I have referred to be not sufficient, I have another authority which may prevail even much more at the Colonial Office than that of Mr. Macgregor. refer is an extract from a lecture on politiThat to which I am now going to cal economy; and regarding the island of Porto Rico, the lecturer says— "So long as the fertility of the land remains unexhausted, it is probable that the slovenly la bour of the small free proprietors may continue to raise a considerable quantity of export produce; but it cannot be doubted that most of its |